ShopNotes Podcast 272 — What's Your Relationship Like with Your Hardwood Supplier?

Lumber Suppliers

We spent a good amount of time discussing working with hardwood lumber dealers on the show. The ones we purchase from select the lumber for us. To get what we want involves a combination of clear communication, ordering extras, and the ability to prioritize the kinds of parts you need.

Last-Minute Projects

John's built-in cabinet is complete. Now he has a potting bench to restore (to become a serving station), a photo backdrop to make, and a signboard planter. It's almost graduation time!

Transcript

Phil Huber (02:58.168) Whew, we did it everybody. ShopNotes Podcast, episode number 272, 272 for today. It's pretty much halfway through the month of May, 2026. We've done it, made it this far. It's a beautiful day here in Des Moines, Iowa. Let's get things started. If you want to contact us, you can do that through our email, woodsmith at woodsmith.com or leave a comment.

on our YouTube channel for the podcast, ShopNotes podcast over on the YouTubes. On today's episode, we're going to do a little check in on some projects John's been working on, a little TV show discussion about our last project build for the season that we got working on here, and some other just fun updates.

and some great conversation. Thank you, as always, for listening and also for those people who subscribe to Popwood Plus, Woodsmith Unlimited. You're the ones who help pay the bills to allow us to do this once a week to join you as three little earworms. I'm Phil. Logan and John are with me today. Let's go.

Phil Huber (04:27.608) Alright, when last we left our intrepid Logan Wittmer, he was embarking on another set of gigantic church doors.

Logan Wittmer (04:39.628) Yeah.

Phil Huber (04:41.464) And let's check in on where he is with that.

Logan Wittmer (04:45.23) there are parts all over the shop. So the doors are officially pretty much all cut, ready to glue up. I'm waiting on the spray booth in the office because I wanted to pre finish the panels. those solid wood panels are going to expand and contract over the years. So I don't want a shadow line of, unstained mahogany to appear. So

We're going to do a little bit pre staining. and per my recent fixation, I'm going to spray the stain because spraying the stain is so much better than wiping it on. so that's where I'm at. I'm getting ready to head off to Pennsylvania tomorrow, for the play and wellness event. so it will wait until I get back. Yeah.

Phil Huber (05:40.268) Okay. Now one thing you

Logan Wittmer (05:41.836) And that's walnut or mahogany dust floating around the shop.

Phil Huber (05:46.412) Right. Now you had talked about on last episode, you had to glue up some styles and rails, is that right?

John Doyle (05:47.459) Corinthian mahogany.

Logan Wittmer (05:57.61) Yeah, yeah. Well, yes, I end up actually gluing up only one. rail. Is it this one? This one? I think it is. No, it's not. anyways, I ended up gluing up just one and it was very, very, minor. The, the.

rails are all the rails and styles are all six inches wide except for the top ones. And those. The stock I had most of it was wide enough to get there was enough stock that was six inches wide or wider, so I didn't have to glue them up. I had to glue up one stupid diagonal rail like this one. 30 degree.

miter on each end. and the last piece of stock I had was five and three quarter inches wide. Like this is stupid, but you got to glue it up. Right. So I ended up, gluing it up, but the way that this, Copen stick profile, of course, I'm gonna show you the spot with a burn on it. But anyways, this Copen stick profile, like the way that that OG

edges. Like you can't see it. You can't see that it's glued up. So it worked out really nicely. the panels themselves did all need glued up. the stock I had was narrower than, what I got the first set of doors I built. that first set of doors, the stock all came in at like 12 inches wide, super wide, which actually led to a fair amount of waste on those first ones. It was funny. I was telling my wife this,

maybe last weekend when I was really doing a lot of the heavy lifting on these doors. I ended up with two pieces of material that are two inches by two inches square and six foot long. And that's all that I have left. It was like perfect. It was it was the the epitome of using everything except the oink on it. So. It worked out really nicely. Or is it?

Logan Wittmer (08:19.726) perfect matching stock? No. Like in mahogany for some reason, we noticed this last time.

some mahogany comes in a really nice rich brown color and then some of it comes in looking like it has been grown underground and never seen a lick of daylight. Like it is albino mahogany. I have a mix of those. It's not awful, but there's definitely a variation and a couple of the panels that I glued up that are behind Phil waiting for stain.

There's some variation on them. The stain should even those out pretty well. so like ideally I would have liked to have selected my own mahogany, but our local lumber dealer, can't do that. so it's fine. you know, these are getting stained, so it's not a big deal.

Phil Huber (09:17.666) Right. Well, I remember the last time you were talking about it and we're worried and the stain ended up doing a really good job of blending those colors in the materials.

Logan Wittmer (09:27.81) Yeah, the, yeah, the, the last set of doors, the really, albino mahogany is what I ended up using for the, the trim that goes around to make the orthodox cross on the front. and it definitely is a couple of shades lighter than the rest of the door, but that very well could be because it's a, it's like a bull nose. It's like a half round.

molding. so the stain doesn't really sit on it. It kind of runs down it. So like, you know, as you're spraying it on whatever, it doesn't, I don't think it absorbs as nicely. So, no, I'm, I'm super happy with where I'm sitting on these. I am installing them. have committed to a date of May 30th to install these. It's a four and a half hour drive to where these are getting installed. So, I have, committed to that day. So let me down by that date.

this time I will say this time I am, I did, I'm doing everything exactly the same as last time, process wise. I was more diligent this time. The last time I did this. So this Copen stick bit creates, so there's the, the 10 and end, right? So that's the 10 and end of all the parts. This is the panel side.

and then this fits in here to make the door. last time I was pretty sure that I was diligent with my.

keeping marked faces down, so sharing a common face. So as I'm running stuff through the, the, the shaper, keeping the show face either up or down. so that when I go to put the joints together, everything was flush. I thought I was really diligent last time. However, it appeared as though I was not because I had some uneven surfaces last time. So I did a bit of sanding to kind of flush everything up.

Logan Wittmer (11:32.398) This time I was very diligent about it, uh, like because it kind of, kind of caused me a little bit of heartburn last time and it actually went together really, really nicely. Um, I think I say this every time, but every time I use the shaper with one of those big bits in it, whether it's a raised panel bit or a cope and stick bit, um, it's phenomenal. Like I absolutely love it. It's solid cast iron. It doesn't move. You can just

feed as fast as you want to feed. I've started to just leave it set on 11,000 RPM, which is the highest speed that it will go, which is on paper too fast for the four and a half inch raised panel cutter. But that means you can feed that panel as fast as you want and the chip loads right. And it just, it comes out butter smooth. The,

profile still needs a little sanding, I think just to open up the fibers for the stain. but yeah, I just like, I absolutely love it. No regrets, no regurts selling the router table. So, yep. I also started sending panels through the, I currently have a, an Oliver drum sander in the shop. It is their new bench top drum sander. say, I think they call it

bench top because you could build a bench to put it on. that's a misnomer though, because it is 385 pounds. Like you're not picking this up and setting it on a bench. but it is an Ocel. Yeah. put it on a dumb waiter to raise the ceiling. Like that'd be great. but like I am sending all the panels through there. I sent all the panels through there. I'm sending.

Phil Huber (13:12.313) tuck it away after every use.

John Doyle (13:14.568) It's a great job site tool.

Logan Wittmer (13:27.222) all the rails and styles for that thing. like sanding is pretty much done. Like there's a couple of joints that'll need a little bit of fine tuning, but much, much smoother the second time around. First time was smooth. Like there was no issues the first time building these doors. This time just feels significantly smoother. Like I could actually make money doing this if I wanted to. I do not want to do not want to. Let's be very clear for anybody that goes to the Serbian Orthodox Church. I do not want to.

John Doyle (13:27.4) Thank

Logan Wittmer (13:57.262) but yeah, it's going nice, going easy, going well.

Phil Huber (14:06.201) All right, well, I mean, you weren't doing photography either at the same time for, so that has something to do with it as well.

Logan Wittmer (14:11.214) that one 100%. Like I just, yeah, I throw my headset on. I flip on a book on tape and I just work and it is, I think I told you guys like, I'm like, this is how the other half lives. Like you work without a camera. Like you're not running back and forth to the computer, to the lights, to the camera, to the work, to yeah. So it is, it is rather enjoyable.

Phil Huber (14:40.089) All right, John, I want to touch on something that Logan mentioned here in getting his mahogany for the door and our hardwood supplier that we use, they deliver, which is a delight. But like he said, we don't get a chance to pick through pieces. And I know we just unloaded some white oak that you had ordered for a project that you're doing or that you designed.

for an upcoming issue. We'll start with you, John. How do you or what do you do when you're ordering when you can't pick through it yourself? Are you communicating with the lumber dealer, like what you're looking for?

John Doyle (15:29.128) I kind of find that hard to do because I just know that they get kind of get annoyed with that. They, one, don't like you to come there and pick through it and two, I don't know how receptive they are to...

requests, I guess. So a lot of times I'm just ordering that much extra to kind of pick, you know, kind of pick and choose how to do it. And kind of a little bit like we talked about last week as far as, okay, I got to be judicious on like how I'm going to glue up.

panels and where they're going to be placed and you know just kind of be picky that way I guess but for the most part when I don't get to see it it's just ordering extra for the most yeah but yeah listening to Logan talk about like

needing certain widths and having waste. It reminds me of my previous employer. We would do runs of custom millwork at times. So that is very much of if you're making five inch base molding, three inch pieces do you know good, four eight inch pieces. Like if you get seven inch boards, you're throwing two inches of every board away when you're like, need.

So I have asked in that place, like, can I get as close to five inches usable boards as possible? Otherwise, yeah, you're throwing a bunch of wood away when it comes to that. So I have asked, you know, but

Logan Wittmer (16:56.216) Yeah.

Logan Wittmer (17:01.634) There. Yeah, there are, there are certain species. found that Liberty will select for you. you, you pay for it, but, top of my mind is the Alder. I think you can, you can call them and say, Hey, I need to Alder. They'll say, okay, what grade, rustic or select and then what width? and they will hand select, I think for six inches and wider, maybe a little bit bigger than that. so you can.

in some instances choose your width, but it's like you're getting anything over six inches. So you might get fewer 20 board feet. You might get two boards that are 10 inches wide, or you might get four boards that are five inches wide. You know, it just is kind of.

John Doyle (17:50.158) And yeah, depending on what lengths they have too, if you're just ordering by the board feet. it's, kind of, yeah, kind of be creative, I guess, how you ask and order and make sure you have enough. But yeah, like quarter sawn, or I mean, quarter sawn wood and rift sawn wood is just generally, it's harder to find wider pieces just because they're on the outside to the trees. So.

Phil Huber (18:11.353) Still Cuper? All right, yeah, you too. Thanks.

John Doyle (18:18.204) Yeah, if you need wider pieces of that, definitely as like, Hey, can you accommodate this request? But yeah, I try not to overextend the requests. they are receptive.

Logan Wittmer (18:28.524) Yeah, well, and there's some instances where it just really doesn't matter that much. You know what I mean? Like, you know, if I had to glue up all these rails and styles, like rails and styles are not something I want to glue up because of it being a front door. There's a lot of forces on it and stuff. You know, the top rail I did have to glue up. It's 14 inches wide. Like you're not getting getting a 14 inch wide mahogany board.

It is not going to be a stable board, you know? but there's some things where it's like, okay, gluing that up to that width isn't that big a deal. Like if you're building, if I'm building, you know, my work bench and I need to glue up the panels for that, it's not a big deal.

John Doyle (19:15.672) Yeah. Yeah, I guess the other thing too is just knowing in the projects like, am I gonna need a lot of like three foot sections? Can I get a 12 footer rather than an eight footer? So I'm not throwing two feet approximately of every board. So I guess just kind of thinking ahead about part sizes and both widths and lengths of stuff you might need. So.

Logan Wittmer (19:39.054) Yeah. What I, what I, what I have often struggled with is like, it's like, how much do you order? And I've kind of gotten to the point knowing full well that for a lot of the magazine stuff, you know, it, it is a business expense. So it's not like I am just paying for it, but like, um, if, if I have to build like these doors, you know, they're 36 inches wide.

seven and a half feet tall. Um, and there's two of them. So I just, do that calculation like, okay, 36 by, you know, whatever it is, 83 inches tall by two inches thick, figure out what that board footage is just of the door slab and then add 35, 40 % to that. And I'm like, okay, that gets me pretty close. Um, in this instance, actually.

you know, I'm left with a very small metal garbage can full of offcuts and that's it. Which to me, that's like, could not have, I could not have teed that up any better. I still have to get more material for the doorframe and stuff, but that wasn't in this calculation anyways. but you know, that that's what I've always struggled with it when you're ordering it. Like if you can walk into a lumber dealer, like if you can walk into a hardwood dealer and you can hand select your boards, which there are a lot of lumber companies you can do that at.

I think that's a lot easier than saying, Hey, just give me X number of board feet. Cause I think that's what I need. And I hope it's enough. And I hope there's not, you know, defects on the faces, even though, you know, they should be graded out stuff like that.

John Doyle (21:20.84) And you definitely have to consider like what the lumber cost is of buying, having extra versus what is my time worth if I run out of them, a couple of boards short and I have to either wait for it to get delivered or if I have to run out there and pick up, you know, a couple more pieces. And so a lot of times, yeah, yeah.

Logan Wittmer (21:38.35) Yeah. Especially if you live like an hour away from your lumber dealer. Like, you know, we're 15 minutes, but if you lived an hour away.

Logan Wittmer (21:50.734) The, the, the biggest issue that I've had, um, apart from figuring out exactly what I need is not seeing the material beforehand. You don't know exactly what you're going to get. Um, and some of it like cherry sapwood is considered a defect. So that should be pulled out. Walnut it's not. So, you know, you might get some walnut that has a lot of sap in it. Um, this

mahogany. The last doors I did out of mahogany had a bunch of wormholes in it. So I had to work around a ton of material on those wormholes. the, what was it? The candle table that I built, those boards were long, like they had to have been close to 14 foot long. They were huge, but it looked like somebody had dropped the bundle at some point because I could see a fracture line like at like six feet on

from each end and it wouldn't break apart, but you could see it and planing down, you could see it and it was still there. it's like, those fibers got broke at some point. Like somebody dropped a bundle on some, some bunks or something like that and it cracked it. So it's like, it's that type of stuff that you don't know without putting your hands on it. You don't know what you're getting now. I say all this and our local lumber dealer, Liberty hardwoods.

and Brian in particular, who we deal with, shout out to Brian has always been really good. If, something like that pops up, I just call him and be like, Hey, here's the photos of what I'm seeing this, you know, these, you know, 30 board fee are completely unusable and I get a credit back for it. So it's not that big a deal. but if I was driving an hour, hour and a half to pick up lumber like that and I got home and those, I would be, my attitude would be a little different.

Phil Huber (23:47.321) Ha

Phil Huber (23:52.025) So on your doors when you got the material, were you picking out and then cutting the frame pieces first and then panels from that?

Logan Wittmer (24:01.966) Yeah, because I knew I knew that when I picked up the bundle, there was not a lot of real wide stuff like I was. I was kind of hoping it was going to be the same as last time where there was a bunch of, you know, 10 to 12 inch wide boards. And it's like, OK, 10 inch board. Those are all panels, 12 inch wide boards. I can get two rails out of it. And when I picked it up, I was like, oh, we got some glue in to do on these guys. So, yeah, the first thing I did is I pick.

the most important parts first, which are the long styles, right? The outside styles. Those are long runs. They have to be straight. They have to be flat. so I picked those out of the best boards and then I started looking at the other boards and say, okay, what can I get out? And then, some of the issue I had, so I have, I generally have Liberty, straight line rip and skip plane stuff. So it's an extra, I don't remember 40 cents a board foot for them to do that, but they'll send it through their skip planer.

to kind of clean off the surface a little bit. And then they'll straight line one edge of it. So you have a fairly straight, piece, in doing so, some of the boards were six inches in the middle, but the ends were five and a half, you know, when the board curves a little bit before they straight line it. So there's some instances where it's like, okay, I'm kind of piecing apart this. And then, you know, I know I can take this, you know,

48 inch section out of the center that leaves me two ends that are maybe five and a half inches wide. I know I can glue those together for a panel, but it has to be this panel because the panels are all different sizes. The way that this, this angled rail goes through the center, you know, you have one panel that's 24 inches, one that's 23, one that's 18, one that's 14. So I don't know. It's just, it's, it's one of those things that

Sometimes I don't feel like I know what I'm doing, but then it all works out the end and I'm kind of like, maybe I did think it through more than I thought I did. Or maybe I'm just lucky. It was just probably more likely.

Phil Huber (26:15.073) Yeah, that's our question is how are you purchasing your lumber and what do you do if you can't pick through it yourself and you're just kind of ordering sight unseen? What's the process that you go through? What's your relationship like with your hardwood supplier in whether they can accommodate your needs in a given project? So, all right.

Let's go through some feedback from last episode. Haven't done that yet. DP Meyer says, to get the steam to scale for the model locomotives, you have to start with the small bottles of water that the airlines give you.

true. Alfida says, I was rather confused with the bandsaw blades, but I can thank Logan for being on time and up to date with his TPI report this week. Perfect.

Logan Wittmer (27:13.198) You're welcome. Again, like I know what I'm doing, but it's just luck.

Phil Huber (27:16.889) Yeah. We got a generic username here says, okay guys, the following groups did Gloria, ACDC and U2. It even goes back farther. Music is a great sound in the shop.

Almost Perfection says, thanks for reinforcing my decision to stay in the garage shop. That was the question about advantages and disadvantages of a garage versus a basement shop. Now I need to work on how a mini split will also benefit my wife somehow.

Logan Wittmer (27:49.304) keeps you out of the house and out of her hair.

Phil Huber (27:52.215) Right, there's that. Also, especially since we're rolling into summer, like the mini split will keep the heavy sweat and stank off of your clothes compared to an unheated or an un-air-conditioned garage.

Phil Huber (28:15.129) JPN 533 says, Phil, why didn't you record episode 274 years ago before I bought a dovetail saw? It would have saved me from purchasing two other handsaws. We had people visiting, so of course I had to redo the wood floors and two bedrooms and the baseboards for the entire upstairs, which is a riff on John's projects that he starts just before large family events, which we'll get to in just a minute.

Puppy Doc is a little disappointed that how can Logan and John not know Gloria? It's like a classic. I would think everyone would know that song. And they aren't that young.

Logan Wittmer (28:58.018) Well, let's just put it this way. Maybe it's not knowing the song. Maybe it was just Phil's rendition of it that we didn't recognize.

Phil Huber (29:03.501) Wow, yeah, there you go.

John Doyle (29:03.622) Yeah.

Phil Huber (29:09.177) Yeah, because John was thinking that it was the Laura Brannigan version, that's mine was. Yeah.

John Doyle (29:13.126) Yeah, that's my jam. But there's no accounting for taste.

Phil Huber (29:18.273) Right, Elphita says that he has now lost all R-E-S-P-E-C-T for Logan for not knowing.

Phil Huber (29:30.595) That's Aretha Franklin.

John Doyle (29:33.178) and it spells respect.

Phil Huber (29:40.611) All right, John, you were talking about your shop cabinet rehab, which I put some photos on last week's show notes page. And I mean, it turned out really cool. It was a cool project to begin with, like great lines to it and details. And I don't remember, we talked about it off camera, but I don't know if you mentioned it during the recording, but there is an almost.

family connection between that cabinet and the Doyles.

John Doyle (30:14.6) Yeah, my parents owned the, I guess you'd consider the local corner drugstore in our town.

and there had been a drug store for over 100 years when my dad retired. And in the back room, there was a similar cabinet where it was like nine, 10 feet long, all one piece, quarter-stone oak front, and it had glass display doors on it with the ice box type hardware on it. And it...

So very similar in the box. The case of it seemed like, yeah, oak front. And then the case was built out of like packing crates. It seemed like, like just nothing. So, and it had been painted on the inside the same like tealish green, blue paint. So I don't know if that was a popular color in the

I don't know, 50s, 40s when that was a thing, but it definitely had a family resemblance to the cabinet that I picked up. But when they sold the pharmacy and we really wanted to keep that cabinet and it was in like this back hallway against the wall and we were like trying to like pivot it or lift, like stick it out and then like pivot it out.

and we could not get it out of this hallway. So I don't know if it was built inside this back room or what. So we ended up just busting out these cheap boxes and saving the face frame to rebuild the cabinet. But like I was telling you, like my sister was in our garage the other day and she's like, oh, there's that cabinet from the pharmacy. was like, no, it looks like it, but it is not. So they're cousins.

John Doyle (32:12.764) But yeah, that turned out well. And since we last spoke of graduation, family, event projects, things have escalated quickly. So it has gotten interesting.

I think right after we recorded that podcast that night, I pulled in the driveway, it was dark and my daughter who's graduating came out and she's like, there's a potting bench down the alley on the curb and it says free, that would be great for my drink stand for my party. I was like, okay, so we're going down there and she's like trying to be all sneaky, like we're stealing. was like, they're literally giving it to you, they want you to take it, calm down.

So we got that home and it was like all the paints kind of peeling off and it was pretty wobbly. And it was like, I can, I can shore this up, you know, structurally. then, so I did that and then started, you know, sanding it and it's like, this paint's kind of gross. I ended up taking off pretty much all the paint and repainting it, giving it a just, yeah, yeah. So, yeah. So that was our curb fine. That was like.

Logan Wittmer (33:16.046) Was that the black thing that was in the studio? Oh, I always wonder what the heck that was.

John Doyle (33:24.836) refinishing. So that got done and then I think it was, so we picked that up, I think Thursday night and then Friday night they're like, okay, now we need a photo backdrop. So then I was, you know, in the shop Saturday morning, scrapping together stuff, basically making a six foot by eight foot palette to put in our

garage for a photo backdrop and then she's got another like Pinterest photo for a planter box and sign and so a lot lot of projects popping up and I think a lot of them are just to keep me out of their hair you know the the shopping list of stuff they're they're spending money on so it's definitely working so but I am NOT looking forward to weddings because if this is a graduation

Could get a little hairy. but I'll have to when when all these projects are done, I'll have to post some pictures. So hopefully they end up pretty cool, but we'll see.

Phil Huber (34:34.659) Which the funny part to me in all of this is that you've admitted to this previously that you'll do this as a maybe coping mechanism to the stress of an event is like just before it start some crazy big project. And not only did you do a last minute project, but you got it done on time under budget.

which I guess only reinforced the fact that you're capable of doing this. So then they just loaded you up with more projects.

John Doyle (35:08.636) Right, right. Yeah. I don't know that's like a trade of ADHD where it's like, don't do anything until it has to be done. And then you just go, go crazy. And then somehow it gets done and you did it right. So luck again to success once again. So

Phil Huber (35:25.795) Ha ha ha ha ha.

John's three deep projects into showing that something can never be too last minute. That's the other one. along with that, for comments and smart remarks here, what have been your last minute John Doyle projects that you've done for events like this? And I'm talking about like graduation, wedding.

major anniversaries, moving, all of those kind of things where you need to...

You need to just get something done.

I guess I'm going to stick with you, John. We talked about the lumber that you were ordering now, the project that that white oak is for.

John Doyle (36:24.84) So that the white oak is for It's a called a library chest, I guess and it comes from Chris Fitch had seen these traveling Library chests, I believe that they would take them to like the Great Lakes Lighthouses with like books libraries that would they drop off so

smallish cabinets and they kind of reminded me of campaign furniture a little bit where they were made to travel, know, had the hardware handles to move them around but.

I guess in today's day and age, I wouldn't expect people to travel with these. So it's kind of more like modular furniture that would look nice in apartments and could knock down. You could take them not with you every day, but when you go to move, they're movable.

Logan Wittmer (37:29.272) I'm just picturing like scholastic book fair type cases.

John Doyle (37:32.712) That's it, that's it, yes. Hey, reading is fundamental, you know? So, yeah, so we're gonna plan on taking these to woodworking book fairs and just like fold them up, roll them in and have our wares, our books and our posters. Yeah, maybe some pencil toppers, woodsmith pencil toppers, but yeah.

Logan Wittmer (37:44.406) Yes.

Logan Wittmer (37:51.64) or pedal our goods.

Phil Huber (38:00.579) I do remember book fairs when I was in elementary school and the

display gondolas or whatever they're called for lack of a better word. Like back when I was a kid, you know, in the 1900s, right, they I thought that they were at that time, I thought they were pretty cool. And then when my kids were little, my wife and I would help out with scholastic book fair and go to set those up. And those were just basically metal vaults.

Logan Wittmer (38:19.438) Back to my day!

Phil Huber (38:39.571) on wheels, know, that you kind of unbuckled and spread apart and whatever, but they still had their kind of cool factor to them that these things have to be display pieces when you open them up, but then also very easy to, to transform. So the idea of like a mobile bookcase is kind of a fun, fun concept.

Logan Wittmer (38:41.101) Yeah.

John Doyle (39:03.696) And all this talk of like elementary school and reading books, I'm going to have to get a personal pan pizza for pizza tonight.

Craving it and I've earned it too.

Phil Huber (39:15.853) We should totally do that with like a woodworking reading club where you send in something and then we'll send you a Pizza Hut bucks or something.

John Doyle (39:26.578) Yes. We gotta get people reading. but yeah, so small cabinet and then I've got an optional stand for it too, cause you know, people aren't just gonna set this on the ground. So we'll see how it turns out, but should be a good one.

Logan Wittmer (39:39.541) Thank

Phil Huber (39:46.509) Okay. Yeah, it's in Mark's hands now.

Phil Huber (39:53.466) Speaking of which, Mark just finished up the kitchen hutch for this issue of Woodsmith. And Chris designed it, it's like, think of like a Hoosier cabinet meets Brady Bunch SoCal cool. And that's probably the right kind of vibes for it. I...

It's one of those things where it may not be your style, but you should be able to dig it because it's just well designed. The proportions on it are nice. A little bit of plywood, solid wood. It's got a fun look to it. I like it.

Logan Wittmer (40:34.872) Can we ask Mark his opinion on it?

Phil Huber (40:38.071) I think he's mostly just glad it's done. There's a level of, you know, this, is kind of a behind the scenes thing with magazine production. Like all three of us love our jobs and the people that we work with, but you get to a stage in a magazine cycle. You know, we have eight week long magazine cycles, probably starting around week six ish. You're like, I just want this done. It's just got to go away.

Logan Wittmer (40:40.788) Yeah, I think so.

John Doyle (41:07.452) I would definitely give Mark a cooling off period before you ask him to get his honest opinion. let him move on to my project first and get some of that angst out.

Phil Huber (41:07.757) you know, or just

Phil Huber (41:13.081) You

Phil Huber (41:18.189) Right, yeah.

Phil Huber (41:22.467) Yeah, which reminds me that if you're not already checking it out on the Woodsmith YouTube channel, we do a Thursday shop update videos with Mark, usually with Dylan as well, kind of giving an update on the projects that they're either designing, building, or whatever that's going on at the same time. So be sure to check that out. Now in the background for all the people who are just on the audio only version of this,

Logan's been sorting through merchandise on his bench as we've been talking along here.

Logan Wittmer (41:56.116) It's the ADHD can't sit here and not do something. No, it's, it's combination of that. And the always like needing to know. So I have a confession. I've had a couple of new tools coming into the shop in the last couple of days. one of which is a large lathe, a small large lathe, but also, I had to drop some stuff off at the, post office yesterday for a plane wellness.

for the plane wellness event that's going on and on the w actually I dropped off UPS and UPS is only a couple of blocks away from one of my favorite little flea markets. And I'm like, called the kids. They were doing just fine by themselves waiting for me. like, well, daddy's going to stop in the antique store. So I did, and I picked up a little Stanley number four, beautiful shape.

Phil Huber (42:51.298) Okay.

Logan Wittmer (42:53.326) tote is really, really nice on it. Nice low knob. This is a type eight for those people that are interested in such things. It has the B casting on both the lever cap, the frog and the bed. But I'm like for 20 bucks, like absolutely. This is also because we have

Throughout the year, we have new initiatives and we have ongoing initiatives internally. Some of which are online education courses where we film and we produce and we sell courses on topics of various flavors. The most recent flavor was a router table class that Phil did, which I don't think is out yet, but it's in the works.

Phil Huber (43:48.473) I think it's actually is out for that you can do signups on it. Yeah, I saw an email on it come out. Yeah.

Logan Wittmer (43:50.282) Is it? so pre preorder. Yeah. Preorder. one that I am doing is going to be hand tool restoration. So we're going to do a little e-learning course on, cleaning up, finding, cleaning up and using vintage hand tools. So there's some nuances, with vintage hand tools that you need to be aware of. So we're going to cover a handful of different things. everything from like de-rusting various tools,

different ways of de-rusting and cleaning up to repainting, to sharpening, to tuning, to all that jazz. So because my vintage toolstash is, I wouldn't call it anemic. Well, I wouldn't call it anemic. I want to have plenty of options. I only have a lot of options. I want to have plenty of options.

Phil Huber (44:34.637) significant.

Anemic?

Logan Wittmer (44:46.83) That's how I'm justifying this little detour into the side quest, as some might say, into the vintage store. Anyways, found this beautiful little stale number four for 20 bucks. And then I'm like, this is one that I picked up and I'm like, you know what? If I find something else, I do this very often. And this is my, this is my way to self-regulate and self-throttle is I say, Hey, that's a nice

XYZ tool as I punch my microphone. That's a nice XYZ tool, but you know what? I will only buy that if I find something else to buy at the same time. So $12 draw knife. I'm like, cool. Don't need another draw knife, but that price is not bad. And if I can find another tool to make it worth the credit card swipe, we'll do it. Well.

booth later I found a number four. yeah, and the whole reason I started looking at it is it was just sitting here. I didn't know what brand it was. Various makers had this style of draw knife where the handles are riveted on. So this is a through tang with a metal butt cap on it. And then it is peened over to rivet it on.

Phil Huber (46:06.925) yeah.

Logan Wittmer (46:15.936) Several makers had this. One of my favorite draw knives is one I have from DR Barton. I'm a huge fan of DR Barton tools. And I was like, OK, I know this is kind of a DR Barton style. So I grabbed it and a quick I happen to have a wire brush sitting here. A quick wire brushing says this is a P W P S and W Co. Which.

Phil Huber (46:43.981) Peck, Stowe and Wilcox.

Logan Wittmer (46:45.962) It is so Peckstone Wilcox company. Eight inch draw knife. So yeah, I was just fiddling. Phil, you had to call me out.

Phil Huber (46:57.869) I think John is still stuck on butt cap.

John Doyle (47:01.032) Yeah. Also peen.

Logan Wittmer (47:11.406) That's awesome.

John Doyle (47:11.634) Double whammy there.

Phil Huber (47:16.888) All right.

Okay, cool. Let's see. So we get a report from you next week on Plane Wellness, Handtool Haven. I think I want to get Colin on the show talk about his recent trip to Taiwan and see how things are going there. Next week, I'll have a little bit more progress to show on my

Logan Wittmer (47:33.282) Yep. Yep.

Logan Wittmer (47:40.366) Yeah.

Phil Huber (47:49.219) desk. I've been working on panels this week, like we were talking about last week and now making the connection and doing some joinery there. So I think that wraps up this episode of the Notes podcast. Want to thank you again for listening. ShopNotes podcast is production of Active Interest Media. It's edited by Nate Gruca and the executive digital editor is Ben Strano. Comes out once a week.

Logan Wittmer (47:51.96) Mm.

Phil Huber (48:18.785) Love it if you could subscribe and as warranted, give us a five star review on whatever platform you're choosing to help the podcast get out to even more woodworkers to join in the fun. We'll see you next week everybody. Bye.